Denied of winnings. Please help!

[AussieVamp2]

apart from the fact that a 12 hour rule is fairly pointless for a football game

if not played one day, hardly likely to be played late that night, is it, as most football is a day or evening affair, so rescheduling within twelves hours means you play at 3 in the morning or 7 in the morning..... 24 or 48 hours makes a lot more sense

[AussieVamp2]

reposted for what, Junior, for betting?

not a term the person is necessarily familiar with, remember

[Junior44]

Huh? I must be missing something. We are discussing betting aren't we? Yes, my question was: Was this match available for a person (the bettor) to wager on ON THE DATE the match was played, 5/14 -or- did sportsfantic, when 5/13 came and went, just sh!tcan the match altogether and not offer it as a viable betting option.

[Junior44]

This is an exerpt from my original post....

Originally posted by Junior44:
I have a question that I don't believe has been addressed.....According to Sportsfanatic, the match was POSTED to play on 5/13, however the match was ACTUALLY played on 5/14. My question is this: When Sportsfanatic's system took the game off the board at the "supposed" kick-off on 5/13, was the match subsequently put back up on the board with a play date of 5/14? Surely there must have been some bettors who had no intention of wagering on this game UNTIL the actual game day. If they went to the site on 5/14 (prior to the actual start AND with no knowledge of the 5/13 line), was there a posted line on this game? And, if there wasn't, wouldn't this trigger the bettor to wonder why this game wasn't being offered? If 500+ bettors wagered on this game, did ALL of them make the wager prior to 5/13? I would think that there would be at least 1 individual who would have logged onto his/her pc on the morning of 5/14 with the intent of making a wager on this match, and upon seeing no line, would have called Sportsfanatic to ask why?

I'll admit that I know zilch about Dutch Soccer, but I can relate to the following scenario: If I wake up Monday morning with the intention of making a wager on the MNF game and discover that there is no line, I would be on the phone in minutes in order to find out why. If they had mistakenly posted the MNF game with a play date of Sunday, would they just NOT offer the game on Monday?.......

Can anybody answer this question for me?



[This message has been edited by Junior44 (edited 05-25-2000).]

[UK2000]

Junior44,

I placed the bet on 12/5/2000. The lines were removed from Sportfanatik on the 14/5/2000 and was not 're-posted' again. That was one of the reasons why I emailed them and was given a confirmation of my bets just before the kick-off of the match.

But the main issue here is :

I was denied of my winnings. The odds were confirmed to be correct by 3 persons from Sportfanatik; the grading master, Okan, the customer service officer,Patricia and the line manager. I was assured by Carlos that my bets will stand. Although Sportfanatik said that their so-called upper management will make a decision on the matchday, I had received an email from Okan just before kick-off that all bets are final.

How sure can one be that the bets was on?

[UK2000]

Ayce,

I agree with what Anton had said. Now the issue is not about the odds. The main thing is that given any game that the date was wrongly posted, SPortfanatik can do anything they want even your bets were confirmed by them; they can called it 'no action' when the result was against them and win your stakes if it is the other way round.
If they are honest enough, they should have let me and the 500 bettors know of the 'no action' decision before the kick-off, not after when the result was out.

[Cons]

I got this funny feeling that if results had gone the other way, the bets would NOT have been called off and they would have pocketed the money...

[Anton]

UK2000

Based on the reactions your original posting recieved, there is probably no one that hesitates who is right and who is wrong. I’m certain that if you were the only person that had bets on this game, you would already have your money. The problem Sportfanatik is facing is that if they admit that your bet will stand they must admit that everybody elses bets will stand also. Thats 700 people.

Let us speculate how much money this could be. Let’s say the average bettor puts 300USD on the match. Then SPF would save: 300 x 700 x 2,60 = 546,000 USD.

[Dot Mix]

Anton

It appears SPORTSFANATIC looked at this as a win-win situation for themselves, and went into this game fully knowing they were going to make a score either way because they had no intention of paying anyone------win or lose. Posting the wrong date gave them the "out" to cancel winning bets and "take the shot" at keeping all losing bets.

Even with this Bettors World expose', the worst thing financially that would happen to them is they would refund bets to anyone who got wind of this stink-bomb, and wanted to know what the heck was going on. Very easy to say after they are "caught" something like:
============================================
Dear Sportsfanatic valued customer:

Thank you very much for bringing to our attention your "no bet" wager that was deducted from your account as a loss. As you know we have over 150,000 customers and sometimes these things do happen. We always strive to correct any errors our computers have made and that is one of the reasons we can prodly call SPORTSFANTIC the best sportsbook in the universe.
=============================================
Happens every day----people sign up for advertised bonuses with even the "reputable" books and have to chase down their bonuses because they are not credited. Sports bettors must get it though their heads that this is mostly a very sleazy business run by people of very dubious character. Not all books---- but if the opportunity presents itself to take the shot at screwing you thats probably what will happen. The internet is so vast with a very small percentage of players having links to whats going on such as those at BW sometimes do. If not for a couple of isolated posters who brought up this thievery no one here would ever know what happened regarding this matter. You can be sure very few of those players having the losing side in this fiasco even know what went on. They just lost another bet and their gambling life goes on!

No one has come on here from SPORTSFANATIC. They've been exposed and have nothing to offer. They just assume this will go away with time and they will do the same thing again and I'm sure have done it before. Sounds like its just another avenue to make some serious money every now and then.

Dot

[Junior44]

Dot, You are absolutely correct. If the average Joe bettor is stiffed by an offshore, there is little, if nothing that they can do (at least to get the money owed to them). Nobody is going to hop a barge and sail the Carribean and attempt to deal with it personally. However, one of, if not THE most important asset an offshore has is it's reputation And, unlike cash or similar assets, once that reputation is compromised, it cannot be replaced. There are basically 3 types of books as far as the importance they place on reputation. There are the books that are flat out crooks (scams, etc.). There are books that, for the most part, are legit but do not give a rat's ass about their reputation. These books intend to stay in business, they payout, but every once in awhile they do something like this. They figure they can garner enough business from the uneducated and/or naive. Then there are the books that "get it". They realize that they are only as good as their reputation, and in a ambiguous situation such as the one in this thread, they give the customer the benefit of the doubt, knowing full well that, in the long run, it is going to make good business sense. I mean, lets face it, every book is going to screw up occasionally. It happens. But, how they deal with it shows their true character. In effect, they will take a hit knowing that it will pay for itself in the longrun. The only thing that we can do is expose the first 2 groups for what they are in forums such as this. And a year or two from now, they will realize they underestimated the value of reputaion in this industry and will be paying for their decison. The irony of the whole thing is: these books don't have to cheat in order to turn a profit. They have a built-in advantage (the juice) that will take care of itself. It kind of reminds me of the people that are convinced that table/dice games in Vegas are fixed. Why risk fixing them when they have no need to? There's no incentive.

UK2000 - Thanks for the clarification. It's awfully unfortunate what happened to you. You were taken without a doubt. And sadly, I don't think there's anything you can do to get the funds that are owed to you. However, you can take some kind of solace in knowing that you exposed this outfit for what they are and hopefully have saved other folks from this happening to them....and for that, you should be commended.....Sportsfanatik will get what's coming to them.



[This message has been edited by Junior44 (edited 05-25-2000).]

[Dot Mix]

to: SPORTSFANATIK SPORTS BOOK

Pay these people what you owe them. It's not too late to reverse your attempt at stealing from them. I've already posted this scenario at a dozen internet forums and message boards on the internet reaching thousands of readers. I've given these forums a "heads up" regarding this situation, and asked fellow readers to contact friends and other forums regarding 'SPORTSFANATIK SPORTS BOOK' alerting them to this occurence. In the long run the crooked sportsbook pays ten-fold in lost business, rotten reputation and bad publicity. A favorable message about your paying these people can be relayed just as quickly!

Dot

[Hartley]

Dot Mix I doubt Patrick will respond. He has no trouble coming on the site to promote himself (i.e. in his anxious replies to questions aimed at PlayersOnly last year) or to bash others (i.e. with Intertops), but now that he must defend himself it looks like he's turning away.

[Anton]

UK2000,

So far we have been trying to argue with Sportfanatik with arguments like "honour in business", " right and wrong", "respect for clients" or "logic". However when they make decisions there is only one relavant factor to take into consideration.

Money.

That's why I think we should shift focus in the way we fight this battle. I have a proposal for you that might get us our money back. However it is too delicate to discuss in a forum. I will send you an e-mail about it.

[pnanda]

Did you try posting @ Player's only/Patrick's forum in g a m b l i n g f o r u m s.com? it will be interesting to see if he responds.

[AussieVamp2]

this is starting to look more and more, as the poster points out, that they lost on this game, so won't pay, as they probably did not realise they could lose on some random soccer game in this fashion......

if it was just the one 200 bet, would have been hardly worth this little epic