Neteller - Pay Pal quick guide

[Jeff]

Who takes neteller? Who takes Pay Pal?

http://www.bettorsworld.com/web/oddswiz/netpay.htm

[<BWorld>]

[<frosty>]

thank you. this is very useful. check out thi slink though.

http://www.paypalwarning.com

i don't know what to make of it.

[chestrockwells]

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Paypal is GREAT, until you have a problem. I used it for over a year and a half for an online business, on a daily basis. Paypals terms of service are "fluid", and that's an understatement. Everytime your bank changes its terms of service, they have to send you notification. Just think of hpow often you get those? Well at paypal, they post an update on their website and it is YOUR responsibility to keep up with it. They average a change in their TOS every 2 weeks! Check it out for yourself. As for sportsbooks and paypal, all I can say is that if a sportsbook accepts paypal, I would hope that they have it figured as part of their "cost of doing business". They will get chargebacks etc. and when they do, they'll find out how UNLIKE a bank, paypal can really be. Customers can EASILY rip you off and there's very little you can do about it. Sounds harsh, but it's true.

[chestrockwells]

This is perfect timing. Sent by Paypal today and I quote.......

"To increase the security of the PayPal system, effective December 13,
2001, members will be required to have a credit card or confirmed
bank account with PayPal before they can send any payments, even if
they have funds in their PayPal account.
To spend the funds in your PayPal account you need to add a credit
card or a bank account". End of quote.

Now think about this. I'm your buddy and I owe you $100. I send it to your new Paypal acct. After all Paypal advertises that one can send money to ANYONE with an email address even if they are not signed up!!!. So you sign up anyway but CHOOSE to remain unconfirmed. In other words you don't feel its any of paypal's business what your bank acct # is or your credit card # is. They are not extending you credit, they are not providing a checking acct. or a loan. Meanwhile I send you the $100 I owe you through Paypal. Now I'm confirmed with Paypal and they know who I am. I say I'm sending you $100. But guess what? You now have $100 in your acct. that you can't touch, withdraw, spend, send or even return to me.
Now tell me, is that stupid or is that stupid. The $100 came from ME, not from Paypal. How is it Paypal's business who you are? How is it "risky" for paypal to let you use the $100? It's not their $100, how are they at risk? It's bullshit.

[ 12-13-2001: Message edited by: chestrockwells ]

[ 12-13-2001: Message edited by: chestrockwells ]

[<BWorld>]

I suppose it's not Paypals choice to make this change though. Probably has more to do with Uncle Sam.

[chestrockwells]

Fine, then they should say that due to federal regulations they need to do this or that and quote the regulation. No, this is crap and besides, paypal has hundreds of thousands of personal accts. that have a few dollars in each of them..........that will now forever be abandoned. I'm not going to go through the bullshit of jumping through their hoops just so that I can access the $3 that remains in there. I can't withdraw it, spend it or send it......so it's going to essentially be given to paypal as an inactive acct. at some point. Don't forget that beyond the hoopla, this is a company that is pissing away money in the millions every month in losses.

[<BWorld>]

They should also refund those $3 accounts promptly, considering the rule wasn't in place when the customers originally sent the money.

[<bob>]

Jaguar should add Neteller. They do not really do transfers with other books and with some recent Paypal problems this would make it much easier to get money in and out.

[chestrockwells]

All I can say is that anyone that chooses to become Paypal verified ought to read through all the fine print. Then contact someone intelligent at your bank and ask them what access Paypal would have to your checking acct. if you provided them with your bank info and if Paypal chose to excercise all their options as noted in their TOS. Then you may not be as eager to become verified.
One thing I will guarantee anyone is that within a year all sportsbooks that take paypal will require that you the sender be paypal verified. That is a sure thing, because otherwise they would be completely exposed.

[<frosty>]

you can always open a separate bank account.

[chestrockwells]

Absolutely. And that would be fine if you were somewhat convinced that it would be the last hoop to jump through. But it won't be.

[Jeff]

Seems like anytime anything "good" hits the market there's always a setback......

[chestrockwells]

I agree. When paypal first started up it was fantastically convenient. My guess is that they must have swallowed some massive losses due to fraud as well as having to essentially write off expenses in order to keep the use "free" and sign up tons of users. Sometimes great ideas go down the crapper because they don't make financial sense. Out here in the West Coast, Webvan was a tremendously convenient service that I used many times. But all of us knew it wasn't going to last and you didn't need a calculator to figure it out. Look at Amazon. Even with every conceivable "spin" being put into their accounting, they're still struggling to turn any profit.......for how many years now? So back to Paypal, here's a great idea that has evolved into something more and more cumbersome and is run by people who are making up the rules as they go along to "react" to problems. And now with their IPO, you can bet that scrutiny will increase and don't be too surprised if they eliminate service to sportsbooks in the near future.

[Dragon]

How in the heck is amazon.com losing money? Virtually EVERYONE I know has purchased something from them at one time or another and this time of year they must do record sales. Please explain this one to me.