The List

[chestrockwells]

Just reviewing the Updated List, and I'm sorry Jeff but I find the following statement you have there to be almost non-sensical:

"It's a great industry with lots of opportunity for the players. But unfortunately it's still a play at your own risk industry."

So what does that mean?? Lots of opportunity for the players to do what? TO SHOP LINES, SHOP OFFERS & HAVE A BETTER CHANCE OF WINNING, BETTER VALUE FOR THEIR MONEY, I PRESUME.

And the next sentence means what? BUT YOU MAY NOT BE ABLE TO GET YOUR MONEY OR YOUR WINNINGS BACK, BECAUSE SOME IN THE INDUSTRY ARE CROOKS & OTHERS ARE INDIVIDUALS WHO SHOULDN'T BE ENTRUSTED TO RUN AN ICE-CREAM STAND.

So, in fairness to the concept of "reasonable truth" in advertising, here's how it really reads:

It's a great industry with lots of opportunities for players to shop lines, offers and have a better chance of winning and get more value for their money. But unfortunately, you may not get your money or your winnings back, because some in the industry are crooks & others are individuals who shouldn't be entrusted to run an ice-cream stand.

Yeah, I think that sums it up.
Sorry but my time for being constructive is running out.

[Jeff]

Where we differ he is that I find it non-sensical to think otherwise. Yes, you sum it up pretty much the way it is.

But you wouldn't be able to convice me that you didn't already know that.

The person new to this industry or sportsbetting in general, yes, they don't know that, and that's really where those comments are directed.

I've always made it a point to stress that playing offshore is like playing the market. Diversify. But we need to make it more clear than just posting it in a posting forum.

Getting stiffed is nothing new. It's happened for as long as sportsbetting has been around.

It's happened offshore since day 1.

Books went under in the early days when there were only 10 books! Nevermind now when there's hundreds or maybe thousands.

Remember Dial a bet?

How about EZ Bets?

Dunes and Caribi just last year and there's plenty in between not mentioned. Books have gone under every single year since the beginning of the offshore industry.

Yes, Aces Gold hurts the most because it touched literally just about everyone.

But they won't be the last.

Some people wil accept those risks and move on. Others may not play again for a long time. Others may use books in territories they feel are safe......until proven otherwise.

My comments come from the heart, as a player.

I'm extremely disappointed by what's happened over the last few weeks.

But as a player, I still see alot of value in the industry as it exists today. To me, the value out there outweighs the downside and as a player I'm willing to take the risks associated with it in order to get that value.

Many won't share my view and that's understandable.

But let's face it, many have been around and have watched certain books go under and said to themselves, "whew!, glad I wasn't playing there! I did my homework! Tough luck for the players that were there!"

But this time, there are those that did their homework, thought they had everything covered, and got screwed anyway. That's why this is more painful than others in the past.

[frosti]

where's heritage? anything we should know about?

[chestrockwells]

Look, I know what you're saying, but ultimately it all comes down to getting paid or getting the money out. And in this crucial question that ultimately supercedes all others in importance, the industry as a whole hasn't made any real progress in years.
Not meaning to denigrate anything but I would claim that the average book on your list or my list isn't more apt to be safer now than it was 4-5 yrs ago, when I started doing offshore. My list, your list, someone elses list ultimately is a list of SAFETY and in this regard, the events of the past few weeks clearly should wipe out YEARS of confidence.

The only thing positive about all this is that it is now extremely unlikely that we'll here someone say XYZ Sports is as good as gold or "safer than your local bank".........hopefully for a long while.