The end of an era: Is Scalping Gone Forever?

[REALITY]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by scott:
[B]bbuster...I said bookmaking is simple as opposed to easy. Oddsmakers & bookmakers are two different animals. Both can do their own thing very well without knowing the others craft. Some of the biggest, and I mean biggest, BM's dont know sports, dont watch sports and have no desire to do either. They have b**** of steel, cold steel. Some oddsmakers, but not all, make terrible BM's because they think they are to sharp for their players. They handicapped themselves wrong. Some very good BM's have a feel for the line. They know the public and what they are going to do. Thats different than being able to spout off stats and more stats. Imo that can get in the way sometimes...Scotty

DOGGIE,

CHEW ON THIS A LITTLE.

WHEN I SAID I HAVE NO OPINION WHEN I SIT IN THE BOX I WAS A KNOW NOTHING B.M. ACCORDING TO YOU AND THE GREAT SPIN MASTER RENO.

WHAT'S YOUR RESPONSE TO THIS POST BY SCOTTY?

RENO,FEEL FREE TO JUMP IN WITH A LITTLE SPIN ALSO,BUT SPIN ON THIS POST ONLY...

ADIOS BOYS...

YOUR FRIEND ALWAYS,

REALITY

[Ronbets]

Here we go again. The macho BM Doggie/Style has emerged as the closer. If your bookmaking techniques are en vogue, then why are you pounding the strip looking for that one great play daily, ala Larry Ness?

Bookmaking is not micro surgery, but it's a trade that requires street and # savy. But the bottom line, do what the owners want. Sure if I'm a scalper/mid I'm going to taunt these conservatives shops and try to embarrass them. Questioning their manhood might loosen them up.

I know Morry Moseman(Doc) from Sauk City, Wis. Specializes in the Big Ten. Big following, but wait a minute. How about SCORE from Boston? Had following that moved Stanford 12pts. Both tout services released a "Lock of the Year". Both had a perfect multi year run. My point. You can't compare these extreme rare occurrences to syndicate moves. Prior to their release of their LOY certain inside players would get the leak minutes before the paying customers. Large BMs(pre DB) would use this lead to tax the huge avalanche of nationwide followers. Sissys or smart business? You dont have to attend Harvard School of Business.

D/S, what the hell are you so bitter about? The DB Screen? It's here to stay so get over it! Both the offense and the defense use it. Are you saying "no fair if conservative stores use it to adjust to market price? Are you saying wiseguys, sharps, et al armed with DB info have a right to loot smaller, slower stores that should'nt move their stale line under the guise of "real bookmakers". You're dreaming. You and the rest off your army want those stale #s. You'll get em, and also get a Dear John story come payment time.

[REALITY]

RONBETS,

I HAVE AN INVITATION FOR YOU TOO.

THE NEXT TIME I'M IN VEGAS IT WOULD BE MY PLEASURE TO TAKE YOU FOR DINNER AT THE RESTAURANT OF YOUR CHOICE.

I'LL INVITE SHARK FROM DON BEST AND HAVE HIM GET A HOLD OF SCOTTY,I'LL INVITE BUZZ DALY AND YOU CAN BRING ALONG ANYONE YOU WISH.

I'LL BE IN VEGAS EITHER IN FEBRUARY AFTER THE SUPERBOWL OR THE LAST WEEK IN APRIL.

I HOPE YOU WILL BE AVAILABLE.

THANKS FOR YOUR COURTESY ALONG THE ROCKY ROAD IN THAT VOID IN THE TWILIGHT ZONE KNOWN AS BETTORSWORLD.

REGARDS,

REALITY

[Ronbets]

REALITY,

It would be my pleasure! I'd have no trouble getting hold of Scott S. Maybe, I'll invite an old oddsmaker that used to help him set the #s. There's a lot of knife and fork talent here in this group.

Looking forward to it. Jeff or Brain can reach me.

Best to you,
Ron

[REALITY]

RON,

I'LL BE LOOKING FORWARD TO IT.

THANKS AGAIN FOR YOUR COURTESY.

ALL THE BEST,

REALITY

P.S.

POSTING AND POKER DON'T GO TOGETHER...

MY FRIENDS ARE CRACKING UP WHILE THEY TAKE MY MONEY ON THIS RARE OCCASION...

[This message has been edited by REALITY (edited 08-01-2000).]

[intheknow]

You know, I have been very civil in this forum since I started posting back in 98, but this time I have to respond.

Who are you people to tell me what kind of businessman I am? I AM a bookmaker, I own a book. I do very well with it. I make money, I gainfully employ over 70 people, I pay off every debt owed, and have been doing it for over 4 years. I've never stiffed a player and never will.
If you so called experts in the field of bookmaking as so fricking great, why are you unemployed? I'm out in the trenches every day providing an honest entertainment service to the general public. If you don't like the way I book, fine. But don't come in here and tell me I don't know HOW to book. If I don't want to provide a service to professional gamblers, so what "I reserve the right to refuse service to anyone ". Every seen that sign anywhere in the US?
I'm sorry to the regular players who post here for my ranting, but the pros, wiseguys, and sharps who think this business is here solely for them and vilify anyone who doesn't run their store up their standards pisses me off.

[sportshobby]

ITK, don't be too offended. You have to understand that Reality's style of posting just begs people to disagree with him and challenge him. Maybe its the CAPS.

[REALITY]

INTHEKNOW,

PLEASE BE CAREFUL.

IF YOU KEEP POSTING LIKE THAT YOU WILL BECOME KNOWN AS THE POSTER WHO WOULD BE REALITY...

HEAVY IS THE HEAD THAT WEARS THE CROWN...

YOU ARE ONE THE FEW,THE PROUD,THE BOOKS OF THE REAL TABLE.

YOUR ESTEEMED BROTHERS OF THE BOOKS OF THE REAL TABLE,THE DEVIL,RONBETS,CHILLIN-THE-MOST,REALITY AND HONORARY MEMBER JEFF OF BETTORSWORLD ARE PROUD OF YOUR STAND.

YOU KNOW THE REAL DEAL,YOU NEED NOT GO FURTHER.

IF YOU DECIDE TO PICK UP THE SWORD OF EXCALIBUR AND HONOR YOUR ESTEEMED BRETHREN,LET THE WORD SPREAD FORTH FROM THIS DAY ON...

THERE IS A NEW SHERIFF IN TOWN!

AND INTHEKNOW IS HIS NAME!

GOD BLESS THIS VOID IN THE TWILIGHT ZONE KNOWN AS BETTORSWORLD AND GOD BLESS IT'S NEW SHERIFF...

YOUR HUMBLE PREDECESSOR,

REALITUS EMERATUS

[SLAM DUNK]

IntheKnow, I would like to know what your stance is on winners. Hypothetical. Player opens up an account with you, bets you limit for 100 games and goes 60-37-3. Do you boot, or lower the limits and if so by how much. If not, and he does the same thing over the next 100 games, same question.................
Same question to all of you other bookies in here. Reality keeps saying Originator and Scalpers. I still find both very ambiguous statements. How does one determine a scalper, if the scalper completes the scalp elsewhere?

[DoggieStyle]

Great Attitudes guys.

This is what Barry Bonds said if the Giants make the playoffs and face the Braves. "When I come to bat Glavine, Maddox, Ashby, and Millwood can not PITCH to me. The Braves will just have to use relief pitchers because... I DIDN'T COME TO LOSE! I CAN'T AFFORD TO LOSE. IT'S NOT FAIR IF I HAVE TO PLAY AGAINST THE REAL PLAYERS!"

Intheknow,

Nobody is telling you how to run your business. But it does affect ALL of us how people run these BOOKS. Maybe not YOURS because your scared to tell anyone what book you work for and thus nobody can even judge your comments. To be respectable in the eyes of the Idiots who run our goverment, WE ALL HAVE TO TREAT PLAYERS WITH HONOR AND RESPECT!

YES IT MATTERS!

To say it's O.K. to RUN OFF players, or RAISE FAVORITES just because the player does not get other lines, or RIP PLAYERS OFF on parlay odds because they don't know how to figure them out, or inventing some reason to not PAY PLAYERS. All of this hurts everyone in this business!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Don't you people ever want to be legit!

For me IT'S DISGUSTING.

Ronbets,

I have had 7 plays since the All-star break. That's all! That's probably not near enough for you? Well I am 7-0. If I wait for the really good plays I will never have to worry about money! You can't bother me. I don't need to book. But what I can do in a booking situation is even more AWESOME! You have no clue what a winner can do when getting the 11/10.

All you guys that don't like it when we say it's wrong to do anything but TAKE ALL bets, from ALL players, are just sore LOSERS!

A winner could never INVENT these reasons to justify not taking someones bets.

Look I don't care if anyone likes what I say. It's just an opinion. But it all starts with wanting to be the best I can be. Not dodge anybody!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And your ridiculous concepts tell people who want to be GOOD and WIN money that they are NOT WANTED! That's what this is all about. PLAYERS WHO WIN MONEY.

Well your concepts are not WANTED.

[REALITY]

SLAM,
YOU RUINED IT FOR ME .

I JUST PAID YOU A COMPLIMENT IN ANOTHER POST.

I DON'T BOOT WINNERS.

IN A POST UP HOUSE WHERE MANAGEMENT SAYS NO WISEGUYS I BOOT WISEGUYS.

THE ONLY WISEGUYS ARE MOVERS OR ORIGINATOERS WHO 30-60 SECONDS AFTER THEY PLAY YOU THE GAME THEY PLAY TURNS THE SCREEN BLACK.

FOR THE MILLIONTH TIME THESE ARE THE ONLY WISEGUYS.

THE OTHER PEOPLE YOU MIGHT RESPECT YOU CAN REFER TO AS SHARP PLAYERS.

SCALPERS AREN'T WISEGUYS.

HOW DO YOU DETERMINE WHO ARE JUST SCALPERS?

EASY.

I TAKE THE OPENING AND CLOSING LINE FROM THE HOUSES I RESPECT.

I EXAMINE THE PREVIOUS DAYS WORK IN A GAME SUMMARY EVERY MORNING.

IT'S THE FIRST THING I DO.

IF YOUR PIN# KEEPS COMING UP ON THE EXTENDED SIDES OF GAMES YOUR A SCALPER.

IF YOUR PLAYING OTHER GAMES WITH ME BESIDES JUST SCALPING,THANK YOU FOR YOUR PLAY PLEASE COME AGAIN.

IF YOUR JUST SCALPING,THANKS FOR STOPPING BY,PLEASE PICK UP YOUR PAYOUT ON THE WAY OUT THE DOOR.

MIDDLERS WHO LAY 11/10 TO PLAY THE GAME ARE WELCOME ANY PLACE I'M SITTING.

MR.MIDDLER IS THAT BEER COLD ENOUGH FOR YOU?

DO THE PRETZELS AND PEANUTS HAVE ENOUGH SALT?

THANK YOU FOR THE COURTESY PLAY AND PLEASE COME BACK TOMORROW I HOPE MY PRICES WILL BE AS ATTRACTIVE THEN.

YOUR 11/10 IS GREATLY APPRECIATED BY THE PEOPLE RESPONSIBLE FOR NOT ONLY PAYING THE BILLS BUT ALSO THE OTHER PLAYERS.

WHAT IS SO HARD TO UNDERSTAND HERE???

REALITY

[intheknow]

Winners are winners, winners become losers, losers become winners, and losers are losers. No one can say how it will turn out. If a player is winning so what. I don't book and just hope everybody loses. Winners come wtih the business. I have no problem with winners and no one has ever been asked to leave because he wins. I mean that's stupid, it's your money he's playing with, don't you want a shot at him blowing it back. We had a guy last football season win 180k betting score play 30k a game, mostly the Rams, at the end of the year he's gone, but you can bet your ass if he is going to play this year he's going to return to the place that paid him and he had such good luck.
the morale of this story is that this guy played with us for 2 years before this and never won, so you never know.

I told Reno before, we don't chase clients even wiseguys. My problem is the followers who call after the move and tie up the phones, and pass because they are to slow. They only give you one or two plays a day, but call you 20-30 times to check your numbers. the first guy in gets the number the rest pass. Check my earlier post about the breakdown of a wiseguy call into a store.

[DoggieStyle]

Reality,

What are you talking about? Scotty has an AWESOME reputation for taking all action! Not 86 ing anybody for any reason other than stealing or being a SLEEPING BUM.

You keep saying there are different types of BETTING HOUSES. You keep saying there are many different types of PLAYERS.

Booking is easy! You guys make it sound like it is some impossible type of business to beat. Any business could just turn away any customers who might not be profitable for them. But it's not right...

And I have better things to do than talk to people who except this talk about WE HAVE A CERTAIN TYPE OF BOOK HERE.

Saying a bookie is giving an honest entertainment service to the general public is absurb. Taking some sick gamblers lifetime savings is HONEST ENTERTAINMENT? NEVER!



[This message has been edited by DoggieStyle (edited 08-01-2000).]

[REALITY]

DOGGIE,

IF IT'S AS EASY AS YOU SAY WHY NOT JUST OPEN UP.

YOU CLAIM TO KNOW EVERYBODY I KNOW SO GETTING THE CUSTOMERS IS NO PROBLEM.

YOU SAY ALL YOU WANT TO DO IS RUN THE BIGGEST OFFICE IN THE WORLD, SO WHAT'S STOPPING YOU?

ROME WASN'T BUILT IN A DAY...

DIVIDE YOUR BANKROLL BY A 100 AND OPEN UP WITH 100/TH OF YOUR BANKROLL AS YOUR GAME LIMIT.

YOU CLAIMED TO BE THE ONLY B.M.WHO NEVER LOST IN YOUR SHOP ON THE ISLAND SO IN NO TIME FLAT WITH NO EXTENDED PERIODS OF LOSING YOU SHOULD BE THE BIGGEST IN NO TIME.

STOP CRYING AND START TRYING!

SHOW US JUST HOW SHARP DOGGIE STYLE IS.

OR IS YOUR BARK LOUDER THAN YOUR BITE?

REALITY

[scott]

Doggie...Your first paragraph above is right on. I dont agree with the "awsome" but thanx. Thats the kind of store we had...Scotty